EEs Talk Tech - An Electrical Engineering Podcast

EEs Talk Tech - An Electrical Engineering Podcast

Inspired by over-the-cubical-wall conversations about the changing world of electronics and electrical engineering, Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman created an electrical engineering podcast. Covering a broad range of topics from the basics of electrical engineering to the tough engineering problems of tomorrow’s technologies, Daniel & Mike bring in members of Keysight’s engineering team to provide their unique perspectives.

All Episodes

Metrology Podcast May 20th is a special day - World Metrology Day! Get a bit of history and learn about all things metrology when you join Daniel Bogdanoff, Bob Stern, and Chris Cox in this special Metrology Day electrical engineering podcast! App note mentioned by Bob: More about Keysight metrology, calibration, and services: Topics and time tags: 0:00 World metrology day, and a brief history of the meter and the ohm 2:00 Keysight University has FREE test gear courses! 2:45 Bob Stern, Keysight Metrologist Chris Cox, Keysight Regional Metrologist 4:30 Why does metrology matter? How does it impact us? The global economy relies on a consistency of measurement and test, which is why metrology is important. It allows measurements made in one country to be used and replicated in other countries. 7:25 Metrology and measurement traceability is important. An unbroken chain of traceability is one of the key components of metrology and calibration. It's a bit like a game of telephone leading back to SI units. 10:00 Keysight DMMs get calibrated off the first commercially available Josephson Junction - a tool that uses quantum physics to provide a very stable voltage. 11:16 Accuracy vs. Measurement Uncertainty A production engineer might say "accuracy" but really it's all about "measurement uncertainty" Vocabulary of international metrology (VIM): 12:15 A practical example of how different instruments have different levels of uncertainty 13:45 What's the significance of measurement uncertainty for a user of test gear or a production engineer? 15:33 The internal adjustments that the factory makes to an instrument are some of the most closely guarded intellectual property / trade secrets. 18:15 The Army uses mobile Josephson junctions to test the DMMs used in Apache helicopter field testing. 18:45 Metrology overkills - times when people went overboard with their measurement uncertainty 21:10 How do you quantify measurement uncertainty? There's "test uncertainty ratio" which uses your expanded measurement uncertainty. 23:00 You can also get to percent risk, which is easy to wrap your head around. Bob Stern and Chris Cox authored some papers on this topic. 24:00 Why do people make measurements in the first place? There are no perfect measurements 26:45 Metrology in the government/military vs. private sector 29:00 There are a lot of factors for metrology equipment calibration and the engineering metrology equipment. There are different "levels" of calibration and different depth of reporting

May 2020

33 min 33 sec

New tunneling modes, the scoop on plugfests, and 40 Gbps! Get the FREE! Tech Tip eBook about testing 6 emerging technolgy standards: Subscribe on YouTube ► ◄ It feels like USB 3.2 just came out, but USB4 is HERE! With USB4, gone are the days of wondering what's behind that USB Type-C connector - all the functionality is mandatory. And, you get double the speed! 40 Gbps over two 20 Gpbs lines keeps Moore's law happy (which makes us happy). Find out more in today's podcast with Jit Lim, Mike Hoffman, and Daniel Bogdanoff. Video version: Twitter: @DanielBogdanoff: Subscribe with your podcast tool: iTunes: Spotify: Google: Stitcher: RSS: Notes & Topics: 1:45 The USB-IF released the USB4 Spec in September USB4 requires that you use the USB Type C connector USB4 is fully backwards compatible USB4 uses a 20 Gbps x2 link (pronounced "by two") so Moore’s law still holds (yay!) USB 3.2 took 10 Gbps and doubled it to 20 Gbps It’s USB4 not USB 4.0 and not USB 4 (confirmed) 10:00 With USB4 you must implement USB-PD (USB Power Delivery), but in the past it was optional. USB4 brings a doubling bitrates, you must use Type C connector, and must be backwards compatible all the way to USB2 13:30 USB 3 and USB 3.2 had a lot of alternate modes, but USB4 implements a tunneling mode. With tunneling allows you to send packets of USB, DisplayPort, or PCIe inside of the USB protocol. This means you don’t have to run it as an alternate mode, which requires extra silicon. 17:00 The silicon is often prototyped before a spec is actually released, so that the spec can match reality and be possible to build. 18:30 USB4 is already being prototyped and tested. At the USB workshop-plugfest USB plugfests are very secret, and company names aren’t used. They use a “test ID number” instead of company name, and the attendance is very limited. In many cases, only Keysight and the company testing their device are allowed to be in the room while the testing is done. 21:00 A “Compliance Test Spec” describes how you test a device against a specification. Because, you can’t test for every single thing in the spec, but you can test a subset of things to verify performance. 22:00 Will USB take over everything? It depends on the other organizations and specifications groups. There are other ecosystems and organizations like VESA (DisplayPort) and HDMI that are autonomous. But, both HDMI and VESA have a USB Type-C mode that allows the protocols to work over a USB Type C connector 26:00 USB4 implementation is very complex! The different speeds that could be used are pretty complex. USB4 is advertised 40 Gbps, but it’s actually 20 Gbps x2. 30:15 It can be 5 Gbps, 10 Gbps, 20 Gbps, and run at x1 or x2, and it can also do alt modes. 31:55 Are there any main competitors to USB4? What about the lightning connector from Apple? 35:30 There’s evidence that there will be a USB4 native display, and some high end USB4 monitors already exist. 36:30 USB4 is coming, and if you want to be on the leading edge you better get started now (and why)! 38:20 - stupid questions: When will see USB5? What’s the lamest way someone could use USB4? If USB4 is truly universal, shouldn’t it go into space? Helpful Links: Keysight Bench Facebook page: Keysight RF Facebook page: EEs Talk Tech Electrical Engineering podcast: Check out our blog:

Nov 2019

41 min 31 sec

Brig Asay, Melissa, and Daniel Bogdanoff sit down to answer the internet's questions about the new 110 GHz UXR oscilloscope. How long did it take? What did it cost? Find out!   Some of the questions & comments S K on YouTube: How long does it take to engineer something like this? With custom ASICs all over the place and what not… Glitch on YouTube: Can you make a budget version of it for $99? Steve Sousa on YouTube: But how do you test the test instrument?? It's already so massively difficult to make this, how can you measure and qualify it's gain, linearity etc? TechNiqueBeatz on YouTube: About halfway through the video now.. what would the practical application(s) of an oscilloscope like this be? Alberto Vaudagna on YouTube: Do you know what happen to the data after the dsp? It go to the CPU motherboard and processed by the CPU or the data is overlayed on the screen and the gui is runner's by the CPU? How does a piece of equipment like that get delivered? I just don't think UPS or Fedex is going to cut it for million+ dollar prototype. It would be nice to see some higher magnification views of the front end. Ulrich Frank:mNice sturdy-looking handles at the side of the instrument - to hold on to and keep you steady when you hear the price... SAI Peregrinus: That price! It costs less than half the price of a condo in Brooklyn, NY! (Search on Zillow, sort by price high to low. Pg 20 has a few for $2.7M, several of which are 1 bedroom...) RoGeorgeRoGeorge: Wow, speechless! R Bhalakiya: THIS IS ALL VOODOO MAGIC Maic Salazar Diagnostics: This is majestic!! Sean Bosse: Holy poop. Bet it was hard keeping this quiet until the release. jonka1: Looking at the front end it looks as if the clock signal paths are of different lengths. How is phase dealt with? Is it in this module or later in software? cims: The Bugatti Veyron of scopes with a price to match, lol One scope to rule them! Keyesight drops the proverbial mic with this one Mike Oliver: That is a truly beautiful piece of equipment. It is more of a piece of art work than any other equipment I have ever seen. Gyro on EEVBlog: It's certainly a step change in just how bad a bad day at the office could really get! TiN: I have another question, regarding the input. Are there any scopes that have waveguide input port, instead of very pricey precision 1.0mm/etc connectors? Or in this target scope field, that's not important as much, since owner would connect the input cable and never disconnect? Don't see those to last many cable swaps in field, even 2.4mm is quite fragile. User on EEVBlog: According to the specs, It looks like the 2 channel version he looked at "only" requires 1370 VA and can run off 120V.  The 4 channel version only works off 200-240V The really interesting question: how do they calibrate that calibration probe. They have to characterize the imperfections in it's output to a significantly better accuracy than this scope can measure.  Unless there's something new under the sun in calibration methodology? Mikes Electric Stuff‏ @mikelectricstuf: Can I get it in beige? Yaghiyah‏ @yaghiyah: Does it support Zone Triggering? User on Twitter: It’ll be a couple paychecks before I’m in the market, but I’d really be interested in some detail on the probes and signal acquisition techniques. Are folks just dropping a coax connector on the PCB as a test point? The test setup alone has to be a science in itself. I’d also be interested in knowing if the visiting aliens that you guys mugged to get this scope design are alive and being well cared for. Hi Daniel, just out of curiosity and within any limits of NDAs, can you go into how the design process goes for one of these bleeding-edge instruments? Mostly curious how much of the physical design, like the channels in the hybrid, are designed by a human versus designed parametrically and synthesized

Sep 2018

44 min 5 sec

USB 3.2 DOUBLES the data transfer capabilities of previous USB specifications, and could mean the end of having USB ports on just one side of your computer. Find out more in today's electrical engineering podcast with Jit Lim, Daniel Bogdanoff, and Mike Hoffman.   1:00 Jit is the USB and Thunderbolt lead for Keysight. 1:30 USB 3.2 specifications were released Fall 2017 and released two main capabilities. USB 3.2 doubles the performance of  USB 3.1. You can now run 10Gb/s x2. It uses both sides of the CC connector. In the x2 mode, both sides of the connectors are used instead of just one. 4:00 The other new part of USB 3.2 is that it adds the ability to have the USB silicon farther away from the port. It achieves this using retimers, which makes up for the lossy transmission channel. 5:00 Why laptops only have USB ports on one side! The USB silicon has to be close to the connector. 6:30 If the silicon is 5 or 6 inches away from the connector, it will fail the compliance tests. That's why we need retimers. 7:15 USB is very good at maintaining backwards compatibility The USB 3.0 spec and the USB 3.1 spec no longer exist. It's only USB 3.2. The USB 3.2 specification includes the 3.0 and the 3.1 specs as part of them, and acts as a special mode. 9:00 From a protocol layer and a PHY layer, nothing much has changed. It simply adds communication abilities. 9:55 Who is driving the USB spec? There's a lot of demand! USB Type C is very popular for VR and AR. 12:00 There's no benefit to using legacy devices with modern USB 3.2 ports. 13:45 There's a newly released variant of USB Type C that does not have USB 2.0 support. It repurposes the USB 2 pins. It won't be called USB, but it'll essentially be the same thing. It's used for a new headset. 15:20 USB Type C is hugely popular for VR and AR applications. You can send data, video feeds, and power. 17:00 Richie's Vive has an audio cable, a power cable, and an HDMI cable. The new version, though, has a USB Type-C that handles some of this. 18:00 USB 3.2 will be able to put a retimer on a cable as well. You can put one at each end. What is a retimer? A retimer is used when a signal traverses a lossy board or transmission line. A retimer acquires the signal, recovers it, and retransmits it. It's a type of repeater. Repeaters can be either redrivers or repeaters. A redriver just re-amplifies a signal, including any noise. A retimer does a full data recovery and re-transmission. 21:20 Stupid Questions: What is your favorite alt mode, and why? If you could rename Type-C to anything, what would you call it?      

Aug 2018

24 min 3 sec